--- Log opened Tue Mar 23 00:00:20 2004
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03:35:45 #corewars:  * bvowk rattles all
03:43:39 #corewars: < bvowk> bah.
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11:50:50 #corewars: < Roy> Hi
11:51:01 #corewars: < willvarfa> hello roy
11:51:20 #corewars: < Roy> How you doing?
11:52:10 #corewars: < willvarfa> not bad, yourself?
11:52:49 #corewars: < Roy> Just fine, sitting here @ school doing next to nothing
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11:56:34 #corewars: < willvarfa> so Roy, done any gridwars recently?
11:57:08 #corewars: < Roy> Nope, I'm totaly out of ideas :(
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12:14:22 #corewars: < brx_> hm
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14:40:57 #corewars: < michal> hi
14:42:20 #corewars: < brx> hi
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15:53:15 #corewars: < Mizcu> Neo
15:53:39 #corewars: < Neogryzor> hi Mizcu
15:54:21 #corewars: < brx> hellaw
15:54:36 #corewars: < Neogryzor> hellaw brx
15:54:57 #corewars: < brx> my idea of distributed minibombers was yuckie, booting took much too long, enemy scanners took me out quickly  ;)
15:57:07 #corewars: < Neogryzor> brx: how many bombers were you launching?
15:59:09 #corewars: < brx> Neogryzor: i tried quite a few numbers.
15:59:36 #corewars: < Mizcu> you could try to get impfinity-style performance
16:00:33 #corewars: < Mizcu> impfinity uses multiple small stones, and the small stones create new processes so heavily that they can continue (for a while) even when one of the stones is stunned
16:01:04 #corewars: < Mizcu> (and of course, the name IMPfinity comes from using also super-heavy impspiral)
16:01:41 #corewars: < brx> hm
16:02:50 #corewars: < Neogryzor> does impfinity create stones continuously or it launches a few booting?
16:03:02 #corewars: < Mizcu> launches few
16:04:01 #corewars: < Mizcu> seems to have 4
16:04:45 #corewars: < Mizcu> (hard to read source)
16:06:03 #corewars: < Neogryzor> brx, you can launch 3 stones and a imp-laucher easily
16:07:10 #corewars: < brx> not sure. those stones were supposed to kill scanners anyway.. they lose their edge in numbers.
16:09:08 #corewars: < Neogryzor> spl 1 / spl 1 / mov (stone1) / move (stone2) / mov (stone3) / mov (launcher) / jmp @vector,{0
16:09:21 #corewars: < Mizcu> It requires work to get many stones work together
16:09:37 #corewars: < Neogryzor> vector launches 4-instruction stones and also 4-instruction launcher
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16:13:38 #corewars: < Neogryzor> but you need very small and trashing stones
16:13:43 #corewars: < Neogryzor> hello Will
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16:14:05 #corewars: < Mizcu> spl #-step, #step
16:14:08 #corewars: < Mizcu> mov {-step, {step
16:14:10 #corewars: < Mizcu> add.f -2, -1
16:14:14 #corewars: < Mizcu> djn.f @0, {-2
16:14:35 #corewars: < Mizcu> enough?
16:14:55 #corewars: < Mizcu> (spl #-step, <step or spl #step, <-step ;)
16:17:13 #corewars: < Neogryzor> you'd need spl #step+1,<-step , (because of that djn)
16:18:03 #corewars: < Neogryzor> mmh, i think that a clear component is necessary
16:19:31 #corewars: < Mizcu> that step+1 is not necessary needed 
16:20:06 #corewars: < Mizcu> but then more optimization is required
16:20:51 #corewars: < Mizcu> and that little one can turn into a clear when everything goes perfect   (but not very often, i have experimented with it recently more than a bit)
16:21:34 #corewars: < Mizcu> and with 4 stones, do we really need all them to go into a clear?
16:21:41 #corewars: < Neogryzor> i suppouse that booting a few stones make it more difficult for mutation, right?
16:21:52 #corewars: < Neogryzor> it would be good
16:22:52 #corewars: < Mizcu> impfinity's stones get into a clear with specialized dat-bomb if i remember right
16:26:44 #corewars: < Neogryzor> (I see sf has changed recently)
16:27:40 #corewars: < Neogryzor> (oh idiot me, i used the wrong link)
16:27:49 #corewars: < Neogryzor> :)
16:28:33 #corewars: < Neogryzor> it is corewars.sourceforge, not corewar
16:33:25 #corewars: < Neogryzor> btw, i liked Will's idea about minichallenge.
16:37:41 #corewars: < will_varf> which was?
16:39:09 #corewars: < Neogryzor> pswitching given basiccomponents. 
16:39:43 #corewars: < will_varf> aha yes, imp, gate and djn wasn't it?
16:40:06 #corewars: < Neogryzor> well, components could change a bit :)
16:40:55 #corewars: < will_varf> those were interesting because they were on-liners with a very clear win-loss situation
16:41:28 #corewars: < will_varf> use of #1 #1 in the pbrain to kill the djn would be disallowed, of course ;-)
16:42:00 #corewars: < Neogryzor> (i was thinking of a clear instead of djn)
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16:42:19 #corewars: < willvarfa> hmm, how much messier and more difficult would it be if there was always a third competitor; a white warrior so you knew it's strategy?
16:42:50 #corewars: < Mizcu> a pseudo-random switcher?
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16:45:31 #corewars: < Neogryzor> much more difficult for newbies certainly :S
16:45:54 #corewars: < Mizcu> then there might be too many situtations where every strategy is chosen and results depend on starting positions
16:47:44 #corewars:  * Neogryzor is agree
16:47:57 #corewars: < Neogryzor> time to go for me
16:48:45 #corewars: < Neogryzor> cya
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18:27:05 #corewars: < joonas> hey all
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18:33:47 #corewars: < Metcalf> Hi
18:34:49 #corewars: < joonas> hi john
18:35:00 #corewars: < joonas> thanks for the data.
18:35:06 #corewars: < joonas> haven't converted it yet
18:36:47 #corewars: < joonas> yay, SAL got its first spam ever.
18:37:24 #corewars: < Metcalf> Hi Joonas.
18:37:32 #corewars: < joonas> no, hang on, it was the corewar.info gateway rather than sal itself
18:37:39 #corewars: < Metcalf> Thanks for converting it for me... I don't mind waiting :-)
18:37:40 #corewars: < joonas> man, you must be seriously lagged.
18:37:52 #corewars: < joonas> no, no, you aren't.
18:37:52 #corewars: < Metcalf> I don't think I am today!
18:38:12 #corewars: < Metcalf> The lag is me, I was reading email!
18:38:18 #corewars: < joonas> right.
18:38:56 #corewars: < joonas> anything good?
18:39:20 #corewars: < Metcalf> Hmmm... not yet.  Just removing all the spam
18:39:54 #corewars: < Metcalf> Joonas, do you have access to Island Write?
18:40:07 #corewars: < joonas> I don't know. what is it?
18:40:21 #corewars: < Metcalf> It's a Unix word processor.
18:40:30 #corewars: < Metcalf> Quite an expensive one at that!
18:40:43 #corewars: < joonas> ah, no.
18:40:45 #corewars: < joonas> why?
18:40:52 #corewars: < Metcalf> Nothing I have access to will open an Island Write file...
18:41:07 #corewars: < jaska> neverheard, who uses it?
18:41:12 #corewars: < joonas> if it's only text you could try hexdumping it?
18:41:23 #corewars: < Metcalf> I have some Corewar documentation is IW format.  It's not only text either :-(
18:41:29 #corewars: < joonas> I mean, if it's textual format. 
18:41:30 #corewars: < joonas> ah.
18:41:40 #corewars: < joonas> hm.
18:42:03 #corewars: < Metcalf> http://www.islandsoft.com/
18:42:12 #corewars: < jaska> and they dont have converters?
18:42:14 #corewars: < jaska> or viewers?
18:42:20 #corewars: < jaska> sounds lame.
18:42:29 #corewars: < joonas> hang on, maybe openoffice can open it.
18:42:30 #corewars: < Metcalf> No, whatever format it is in, I can't see any plain text
18:42:51 #corewars: < joonas> what's the file extension?
18:42:59 #corewars: < Metcalf> That's a good idea.  Neither Lotus WordPro, or MS Word will open it.
18:43:01 #corewars: < Metcalf> .ISL
18:44:54 #corewars:  * joonas checks the university 
18:45:13 #corewars: < jaska> hmm, either that site is on a 64k line or something
18:45:35 #corewars: < joonas> no uni doesn't have islandwrite either
18:45:50 #corewars: < jaska> tried asking islandsoft.com for a viewer or a converter
18:45:51 #corewars: < jaska> ?
18:46:29 #corewars: < Metcalf> They probably charge for it!
18:46:34 #corewars: < jaska> lol.
18:47:11 #corewars: < Metcalf> I only want to read one file.  Looks like they charge a fortune for everything
18:47:29 #corewars: < jaska> oh well, greedy bastards
18:47:44 #corewars: < Metcalf> Even the file format would do, I'd knock something up to read it so I can extract the text
18:48:09 #corewars: < jaska> if its supposedly text and 'strings' wont reveal anything its probably encoded/compressed
18:49:05 #corewars: < joonas> can you get whoever sent it to you to convert it?
18:50:52 #corewars: < Metcalf> No, it's the documentation to the Lisp Corewar interpretter, which is no longer available online
18:51:29 #corewars: < joonas> the lisp interpreter?  I'm sure I downloaded it only a few months ago
18:51:47 #corewars: < joonas> is your the one written by the swedish bloke?
18:51:51 #corewars: < joonas> your -> yours
18:54:32 #corewars: < Metcalf> Leif Lingren
18:54:40 #corewars: < Metcalf> The page has gone
18:54:58 #corewars: < Metcalf> Not to worry, I have the entire page saved to disk.
18:56:09 #corewars: < joonas> can't find a file format description anywhere
18:56:13 #corewars: < joonas> on the web
18:57:34 #corewars: < jaska> could try reverse engineering the format, but with nothing to test with its nontrivial
18:58:34 #corewars: < joonas> ah, on the What's New part of their website, they have a "FREE IslandInTEXT Evaluation"
18:59:02 #corewars: < joonas> apparently that can do conversion to HTML
18:59:57 #corewars: < Metcalf> I've looked on the web too
19:00:14 #corewars: < Metcalf> I could try obtaining that :-)
19:00:17 #corewars: < joonas> the islandintext runs on windows too
19:00:53 #corewars: < joonas> getting a free evaluation looks quite painful.  fill in a holw bunch of personal information, then a salesrep will call you!
19:01:37 #corewars: < Metcalf> :-(
19:03:32 #corewars: < joonas> kind of odd that they support HP 9000, IBM RS/6000, and both SunOS and Solaris, but not linux.
19:04:55 #corewars: < joonas> but if you register, you're eligible to Win Free Stuff. lol.
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19:22:57 #corewars: < Metcalf> Stupid power button below the delete key :-(
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19:24:31 #corewars: < Metcalf> Does anyone have a copy of TestWarrior v1.3?
19:24:55 #corewars: < joonas> not me. where was it submitted?
19:27:42 #corewars: < Metcalf> It's a program to test warrior, by Phil Knight.
19:27:54 #corewars: < Metcalf> His web page no longer exists though :-(
19:28:17 #corewars: < joonas> shame.  IIRC his was a nice page too.
19:29:39 #corewars: < Metcalf> I've got it save to disk, all of it apart from TW1.3
19:33:40 #corewars: < joonas> do you archive all CW related websites?
19:34:04 #corewars: < Metcalf> Something I would like are J K Lewis's pages.  I doubt anyone has them saved though :-(
19:34:48 #corewars: < joonas> bbs
19:40:11 #corewars:  * joonas returns with a bottle of coffee
19:40:47 #corewars: < Metcalf> :-)
19:41:03 #corewars: < Metcalf> Scott Adkin's used to have a web page too
19:42:53 #corewars: < joonas> he had the warrior comparison charts
19:43:54 #corewars: < Metcalf> Hmmm... wasn't that Manley?
19:44:12 #corewars: < joonas> ah, so it was.
19:44:16 #corewars: < Metcalf> I don't think I've seen this before.  Seems to be an evolver.
19:44:24 #corewars: < Metcalf> Adkins = first warrior library
19:44:27 #corewars: < joonas> what's that?
19:44:47 #corewars: < Metcalf> Whoops, this: http://lecs.cs.ucla.edu/~daveey/art/code/corewars/
19:44:50 #corewars: < joonas> right, that was it.  I've got the library somewhere if you don't have it.
19:45:27 #corewars: < Metcalf> I've got the library thanks, I'd just like his webpage.  I found the one above by searching for his name since the archive is there
19:46:23 #corewars: < joonas> what about archive.org?
19:47:05 #corewars: < Metcalf> Not in there.
19:47:17 #corewars: < Metcalf> Archive.org now has text seaching by the way :-)
19:47:27 #corewars: < Metcalf> (about time too)
19:47:53 #corewars: < Metcalf> Searching for Corewar, Redcode and Djn brought up a few things, but most I'd seen before
19:48:03 #corewars: < Metcalf> Okay, time to go :-(
19:48:33 #corewars: < joonas> lol, "AfterMath: Unanswered Questions from 9/11"
19:48:42 #corewars: < joonas> oh, ok.
19:48:50 #corewars: < joonas> see you later in the week
19:49:12 #corewars: < Metcalf> Is that the page with all the conspiracy theories?
19:49:24 #corewars: < Metcalf> Several pages long, IIRC
19:49:33 #corewars: < joonas> no idea. just liked the name
19:49:44 #corewars: < Metcalf> Oh! :-)
19:49:50 #corewars:  * Metcalf waves
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19:50:58 #corewars: < joonas> not that multiples of 1/11 aren't interesting fractions. :)
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21:07:53 #corewars:  * joonas detaches
21:27:28 #corewars: < joonas> www.citeseer.com is back up
21:27:30 #corewars:  * joonas rejoices
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--- Log closed Wed Mar 24 00:00:34 2004